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	<title>Comments on: The Poverty of PPE, Episode Eight</title>
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	<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/</link>
	<description>Chris Brooke's Weblog</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 13:18:46 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Nakul</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-177233</link>
		<dc:creator>Nakul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Mar 2008 13:10:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-177233</guid>
		<description>No, I was quoting that in support of your comment, pardon me for not making it clearer. Though, as it happens, I disagree with Austin's reading of Aristotle's position on this. I don't think Aristotle equates akrasia with 'loss of control' at all, certainly not in the sense Austin's counterexample implies. But then that's a fault of his commentators, who are determined to misread Aristotle in Book VII as saying that. Austin's is indeed a good point that needed to be made, if only to rescue Aristotle from his interpreters.

And there we go again with our trivial 'linguistic' philosophy ... :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, I was quoting that in support of your comment, pardon me for not making it clearer. Though, as it happens, I disagree with Austin&#8217;s reading of Aristotle&#8217;s position on this. I don&#8217;t think Aristotle equates akrasia with &#8216;loss of control&#8217; at all, certainly not in the sense Austin&#8217;s counterexample implies. But then that&#8217;s a fault of his commentators, who are determined to misread Aristotle in Book VII as saying that. Austin&#8217;s is indeed a good point that needed to be made, if only to rescue Aristotle from his interpreters.</p>
<p>And there we go again with our trivial &#8216;linguistic&#8217; philosophy &#8230; :)</p>
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		<title>By: Jimmy Doyle</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-177226</link>
		<dc:creator>Jimmy Doyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Mar 2008 11:34:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-177226</guid>
		<description>If you mean to deny my claim that Austin's point was "a very good one that needed to be made," Nakul, I can't discern any reasons for such a denial in your post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you mean to deny my claim that Austin&#8217;s point was &#8220;a very good one that needed to be made,&#8221; Nakul, I can&#8217;t discern any reasons for such a denial in your post.</p>
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		<title>By: Nakul</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-177063</link>
		<dc:creator>Nakul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Mar 2008 01:39:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-177063</guid>
		<description>The reference to Austin brought to mind this excellent essay by Martha Nussbaum (who is as rooted in 'linguistic' philosophy as the best (worst?) of them but retains an admirable consciousness of history) about Judith Butler. I quote at length:

'The idea of gender as performance is Butler's most famous idea, and so it is worth pausing to scrutinize it more closely. She introduced the notion intuitively, in Gender Trouble, without invoking theoretical precedent. Later she denied that she was referring to quasi-theatrical performance, and associated her notion instead with Austin's account of speech acts in How to Do Things with Words. Austin's linguistic category of "performatives" is a category of linguistic utterances that function, in and of themselves, as actions rather than as assertions. When (in appropriate social circumstances) I say "I bet ten dollars," or "I'm sorry," or "I do" (in a marriage ceremony), or "I name this ship...," I am not reporting on a bet or an apology or a marriage or a naming ceremony, I am conducting one.
Butler's analogous claim about gender is not obvious, since the "performances" in question involve gesture, dress, movement, and action, as well as language. Austin's thesis, which is restricted to a rather technical analysis of a certain class of sentences, is in fact not especially helpful to Butler in developing her ideas. Indeed, though she vehemently repudiates readings of her work that associate her view with theater, thinking about the Living Theater's subversive work with gender seems to illuminate her ideas far more than thinking about Austin.

Nor is Butler's treatment of Austin very plausible. She makes the bizarre claim that the fact that the marriage ceremony is one of dozens of examples of performatives in Austin's text suggests "that the heterosexualization of the social bond is the paradigmatic form for those speech acts which bring about what they name." Hardly. Marriage is no more paradigmatic for Austin than betting or ship-naming or promising or apologizing. He is interested in a formal feature of certain utterances, and we are given no reason to suppose that their content has any significance for his argument. It is usually a mistake to read earth-shaking significance into a philosopher's pedestrian choice of examples. Should we say that Aristotle's use of a low-fat diet to illustrate the practical syllogism suggests that chicken is at the heart of Aristotelian virtue? Or that Rawls's use of travel plans to illustrate practical reasoning shows that A Theory of Justice aims at giving us all a vacation?'

Eye-roller it most certainly is, but it would be rather a mistake to read earth-shaking significance into the High Table example as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The reference to Austin brought to mind this excellent essay by Martha Nussbaum (who is as rooted in &#8216;linguistic&#8217; philosophy as the best (worst?) of them but retains an admirable consciousness of history) about Judith Butler. I quote at length:</p>
<p>&#8216;The idea of gender as performance is Butler&#8217;s most famous idea, and so it is worth pausing to scrutinize it more closely. She introduced the notion intuitively, in Gender Trouble, without invoking theoretical precedent. Later she denied that she was referring to quasi-theatrical performance, and associated her notion instead with Austin&#8217;s account of speech acts in How to Do Things with Words. Austin&#8217;s linguistic category of &#8220;performatives&#8221; is a category of linguistic utterances that function, in and of themselves, as actions rather than as assertions. When (in appropriate social circumstances) I say &#8220;I bet ten dollars,&#8221; or &#8220;I&#8217;m sorry,&#8221; or &#8220;I do&#8221; (in a marriage ceremony), or &#8220;I name this ship&#8230;,&#8221; I am not reporting on a bet or an apology or a marriage or a naming ceremony, I am conducting one.<br />
Butler&#8217;s analogous claim about gender is not obvious, since the &#8220;performances&#8221; in question involve gesture, dress, movement, and action, as well as language. Austin&#8217;s thesis, which is restricted to a rather technical analysis of a certain class of sentences, is in fact not especially helpful to Butler in developing her ideas. Indeed, though she vehemently repudiates readings of her work that associate her view with theater, thinking about the Living Theater&#8217;s subversive work with gender seems to illuminate her ideas far more than thinking about Austin.</p>
<p>Nor is Butler&#8217;s treatment of Austin very plausible. She makes the bizarre claim that the fact that the marriage ceremony is one of dozens of examples of performatives in Austin&#8217;s text suggests &#8220;that the heterosexualization of the social bond is the paradigmatic form for those speech acts which bring about what they name.&#8221; Hardly. Marriage is no more paradigmatic for Austin than betting or ship-naming or promising or apologizing. He is interested in a formal feature of certain utterances, and we are given no reason to suppose that their content has any significance for his argument. It is usually a mistake to read earth-shaking significance into a philosopher&#8217;s pedestrian choice of examples. Should we say that Aristotle&#8217;s use of a low-fat diet to illustrate the practical syllogism suggests that chicken is at the heart of Aristotelian virtue? Or that Rawls&#8217;s use of travel plans to illustrate practical reasoning shows that A Theory of Justice aims at giving us all a vacation?&#8217;</p>
<p>Eye-roller it most certainly is, but it would be rather a mistake to read earth-shaking significance into the High Table example as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Jimmy Doyle</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175845</link>
		<dc:creator>Jimmy Doyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Mar 2008 11:18:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175845</guid>
		<description>Ha ha! That's it -- it's something to do with Playaway, isn't it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ha ha! That&#8217;s it &#8212; it&#8217;s something to do with Playaway, isn&#8217;t it?</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Brooke</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175379</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Brooke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 14:21:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175379</guid>
		<description>Judith or Joseph? James or John Stuart? (Immanuel or Brian?)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Judith or Joseph? James or John Stuart? (Immanuel or Brian?)</p>
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		<title>By: Jimmy Doyle</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175359</link>
		<dc:creator>Jimmy Doyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 13:12:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175359</guid>
		<description>But can someone please tell me what Butler, Hume, Kant and Mill are all supposed to have in common?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But can someone please tell me what Butler, Hume, Kant and Mill are all supposed to have in common?</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Brooke</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175347</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Brooke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 12:21:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175347</guid>
		<description>Not quite: Pateman took Theory of Politics in1968, which was an optional paper that you could do in addition to the Moral and Political Philosophy paper. I haven't yet got a good sense of what the differences were, and my (very limited) attempt to track down a 1968-era exam paper hasn't yet borne fruit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not quite: Pateman took Theory of Politics in1968, which was an optional paper that you could do in addition to the Moral and Political Philosophy paper. I haven&#8217;t yet got a good sense of what the differences were, and my (very limited) attempt to track down a 1968-era exam paper hasn&#8217;t yet borne fruit.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Bertram</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175342</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Bertram</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 12:19:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175342</guid>
		<description>Of course the "Theory of Politics" paper was introduced subsequent to this and the publication of "A Theory of Justice" made a big difference too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course the &#8220;Theory of Politics&#8221; paper was introduced subsequent to this and the publication of &#8220;A Theory of Justice&#8221; made a big difference too.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Brooke</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175335</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Brooke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 12:07:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175335</guid>
		<description>When I finally got around to reading &lt;I&gt;How to do things with words&lt;/I&gt; (around 1996) I was quite struck by how it wasn't the book I expected it to be, given the familiar reputation and criticisms of "Oxford ordinary language philosophy" (or whatever you wanted to call it), in particular in the fact of (i) Austin's willingness to put the distinctions he himself sets up under some quite considerable strain and (ii) the overriding concern with the "doing things" rather than blandly with the words.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I finally got around to reading <i>How to do things with words</i> (around 1996) I was quite struck by how it wasn&#8217;t the book I expected it to be, given the familiar reputation and criticisms of &#8220;Oxford ordinary language philosophy&#8221; (or whatever you wanted to call it), in particular in the fact of (i) Austin&#8217;s willingness to put the distinctions he himself sets up under some quite considerable strain and (ii) the overriding concern with the &#8220;doing things&#8221; rather than blandly with the words.</p>
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		<title>By: Jimmy Doyle</title>
		<link>http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175302</link>
		<dc:creator>Jimmy Doyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 10:29:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://virtualstoa.net/2008/03/05/the-poverty-of-ppe-episode-eight/#comment-175302</guid>
		<description>The criticism of Austin is silly. The High Table setting is an eye-roller, certainly; but the point (the possibility of 'clear-eyed' akrasia) is a very good one that needed to be made, as there was (is) a strong tendency to regard akrasia as 'loss of control'. The passage has often been referred to subsequently (as by Davidson, not himself a footling trivia-monger), and for good reason.

If there were a prize for guessing what Butler, Hume, Kant and Mill have in common in this context, I'd have little chance of winning it. All empiricists? no... theists? no... English-speakers? no... Perhaps they are all 'bourgeois'? But then isn't Kierkegaard too?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The criticism of Austin is silly. The High Table setting is an eye-roller, certainly; but the point (the possibility of &#8216;clear-eyed&#8217; akrasia) is a very good one that needed to be made, as there was (is) a strong tendency to regard akrasia as &#8216;loss of control&#8217;. The passage has often been referred to subsequently (as by Davidson, not himself a footling trivia-monger), and for good reason.</p>
<p>If there were a prize for guessing what Butler, Hume, Kant and Mill have in common in this context, I&#8217;d have little chance of winning it. All empiricists? no&#8230; theists? no&#8230; English-speakers? no&#8230; Perhaps they are all &#8216;bourgeois&#8217;? But then isn&#8217;t Kierkegaard too?</p>
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